Your whole premise is wrong, wrong on so many levels. But the basic one is that the “Palestinian” were expelled from anywhere. I was born in British Palestine and my family was there from the early 30s. Five Arab nations in 1948 told their brethren that they were going to push the Jews into the sea, so they should flee their homes in Isr…
Your whole premise is wrong, wrong on so many levels. But the basic one is that the “Palestinian” were expelled from anywhere. I was born in British Palestine and my family was there from the early 30s. Five Arab nations in 1948 told their brethren that they were going to push the Jews into the sea, so they should flee their homes in Israel, meanwhile simultaneously expelling Jews from Arab lands. Stick to psychology and don’t pretend to be a historian.
“If the Jews laid down their arms there would be no Israel. If the Arabs laid down their arms there would be peace.”
Dear genocide-apologist Ely (Eli eli lama sabachtani),
Israel has been founded on a massive campaign of ethnic cleansing, long and carefully prepared in advance by David Ben Goerion (who can be best called the Adolf Hitler for the Palestinians) and his military and orientalist advisors. The fourth and final version of that plan was called plan Dalet. This campaign is documented well, like the so called new Israeli historians found out after they got access to declassified military documents, including orders to zionist militia not to make any distinction between guilty and not guilty while assaulting and destroying Palestinian villages to speed up pressure during the expulsion-project, although Israeli society still prefers to get drunk repeatedly on bedtimestories like that the Palestinians would have left their land voluntarily.
At the moment the ethnic cleansing started, only one third of the population in British Mandate Palestine was Jewish and only 5,8% of the land was in Jewish hands. Understandably, David Ben Goerion had accepted the unfair UN partition plan in which the zionists got, despite of the situation as mentioned, most of the land (56%) assigned. However in reality David Ben Goerion still wanted to realise his initial bid to the UN, namely 80% of Palestine. Needless to say that it is hard to establish a viable Jewish democratic state (a democracy in which the zionists will have and remain having the upper hand) even in 56%, let alone 80%, of Palestine, if only one third of the population is Jewish and merely 5,8% in Jewish hands. So the campaign of ethnic cleansing was meant to solve that problem.
So under the watchful eye of the British troops which stood by idly, a sheer terrorist-campaign against Palestinians was conducted by zionist militia like the Hagana, the Irgun and the Stern. Palestinian families were often not warned in advance but simply blown up or torched while being in their houses. People trying to leave their houses in fear were randomly sprayed with stengun-bullets. Pretty-looking Palestinian girls gang-raped. Palestinian men between 10 and 50 years old caught, separated from the rest, lined up and executed on the spot, based on dubious namelists of zionist intelligence officers, just to instill fear by the other remaining Palestinians or just for having fun. Many villages were totally destroyed and mines were planted in the rubble after, just to prevent Palestinians who managed to escape from returning. This happened especially after Palestinian resistance. Other villages were left behind by Palestinians in advance, who fled in desperation after they heard of the zionist violence. These villages were looted by zionist militia, after which houses, land and other possessions were assigned to Jewish families.
Furthermore, it’s another sick zionist fairytale that little Israel has been invaded by five Arab Goliaths, after the state of Israel was declared. In reality the zionist militia had the upper hand from the beginning for several reasons.
Firstly because the backbone of the Palestinian resistance against British favoritism of zionism during the British Mandate was already effectively broken by the British army during the thirties.
Secondly, because the zionist lobby was able to get Great Brittain in check, so it wouldn’t intervene.
Thirdly, because the zionists planned the campaign of ethnic cleansing well and long in advance, gathering intelligence in a systemic way about Palestinian villages and its inhabitants (the so called village files) while building up a capable force of well-trained militiamen - especially the Palmach, a section of the Haganah.
Fourthly, because the zionists succeeded in concluding a secret deal with king Abdallah from Transjordan, who had the only capable professional Arab army (trained and led by British officers) Israel had to fear. The agreement made was that king Abadallah could get the West Bank and East Jerusalem in exchange for looking the other way while zionist forces would take the rest by force.
Fifthly, because the zionists succeeded via the zionist communist party in Palestine to secure import from superior weaponry from the Soviet Union.
Sixthly, because there was in practice an enormous gap between the retoric used by Arabic nations in public on the one hand and the invading Arab militia on the other hand. The latter often mainly consisted out of poorly trained volunteers, which were inferior in numbers to the zionist forces, besides that they got not enough and often inferior weaponry, badly organised logistic supplylines and were often led by incapable commanders with different and competing interests.
Hence, let us not mince words here. At the heart of zionism (and the conflict itself) lies the idea of Jewish supremacy. Therefore zionism considers Palestinians just as subhumans or collateral damage, during the landgrab it envisions (which encompasses in reality much more than just the territory of former British Mandate Palestine by the way), as the history of zionism, not only during the period of the establishment of Israel as a Jewish state but also thereafter clearly points out.
At the same time the west is just supposed to swallow this utter criminality in silence because of feelings of holocaustguilt or in the belief of the so called enormous complexity of this conflict, like Desmet does gullibly, skillfully manipulated to do so by the powerful zionist lobby.
Description: When Israeli graduate student Teddy Katz meticulously documented a massacre of Palestinian civilians surrounding Israel's independence, he was initially celebrated for his groundbreaking work. But soon, he was stripped of his degrees and was publicly shamed as a fraudulent traitor. Decades later, incendiary new evidence emerges to corroborate Teddy's initial findings, not just vindicating him, but raising profound questions about how Israelis — and we all — deal with the darker chapters of history.
IMDb: In the war of 1948 hundreds of Palestinian villages were depopulated. Israelis call it 'The War of Independence. Palestinians call it 'Nakba"'. The film examines one village - Tantura and why "Nakba" is taboo in Israeli society.
“I read your presentation, which I think is more a description of the details of the Israeli assaults and actions, than a well-argued disclosure.”
Well, maybe it's an idea to set the historical record straight first? Or are you really so naive to think that you can argue about this conflict without having any clue about that, just based on the general mood regarding the topic as perceived by yourself, supplemented with your apparent belief that history is determined by sheer contingency, plus some feelings in your underbelly?
Further, these “details” (in which you apparently fail to see any coherence or logic) show for most people, who study the matter concerned, and are not politically invested in the zionist project, a clear pattern about landgrab, apart from the fact that forced displacement qualifies as a war crime – just to mention another minor detail.
There is even resolution 194 of the General Assembly of the United Nations, which demands that Israel should let Palestinian refugees back in and compensate them fairly for loss of damage to their property, which, like may other resolutions of the General Assembly or the Security Council, Israel has never given any follow up to.
Anyhow, apart from the fact that we are just debating here in some minor comment-section on substack, it’s too easy to demand proof here like I am defending a dissertation or someone in court, while apparently you are not realising that your own assumption that the conflict can be reduced to a spiral of violence without any clear cause is equally subjected to that requirement and you are not entertaining the slightest effort to underpin this far too easy and risk-free belief.
Since you are not willing to engage seriously into this matter, I refer here only to Alan Pappé, The ethnic cleansing of Palestine, Oneworld Publications London 2006 for a good start.
With all respect Mia, but this is a comment section, not an independent Substack post or essay as the one written by Desmet where one would expect further links to back up sweeping (and above all uninformed!) statements.
Why be so critical at someone who is just posting a comment while you seem not to have any problem with Desmet’s empty words? (Yes, that’s my opinion too, and I recommend everyone here to read the works of authors like Ilan Pappe, if you want evidence so badly, pls go check it out!)
Desmet is writing about an ongoing genocide on an oppressed people as “where two parties fight, there are two to blame”, and he does advocate that it is better not to take a stance instead. This may be a very popular opinion among his readers but it has no factual basis and it does not show he knows history, not even a bit. There is an unequal power balance, a hierarchy, that makes it something very different than an endless spiral of violence with no beginning and no end. And yes, he may have to read some actual history books to be able to lecture his audience about this on a well informed basis.
And btw, the conversation in this comment section is not about the question of evidence as you like to maintain, with that you’re derailing the discussion.
It’s just very typical, and Desmet is no exception here, that many people from the anti-flu movement were crying about genocide when it came to vaccins and the Great Reset, but that they lost their ability to recognize an actual genocide when it’s happening now, in front of our eyes, live-streamed on social media. That is a huge double standard of which I think Desmet is guilty too with all his fuzzy talk about this genocide being “a classic human drama”, which is happening “because people lose themselves in petty sentiments.”
Injustice is not only bad when it is about to hit us personally. Many people from the anti-flu movement are not treating the perpetrators of the the genocide in Gaza the same way as they would judge Fauci, for example, and that is hypocrite.
Anti-flu? I am anti-covid-narrative and I can clearly see genocide happening. It's actually not that difficult, because the same people are behind all of these developments.
do not delude yourself with fairy tales about the "right starting premise" when a systematic genocide against Palestinian civilians is currently taking place.
Are you saying that you are righteous and at the same time you support genocide?
Your whole premise is wrong, wrong on so many levels. But the basic one is that the “Palestinian” were expelled from anywhere. I was born in British Palestine and my family was there from the early 30s. Five Arab nations in 1948 told their brethren that they were going to push the Jews into the sea, so they should flee their homes in Israel, meanwhile simultaneously expelling Jews from Arab lands. Stick to psychology and don’t pretend to be a historian.
“If the Jews laid down their arms there would be no Israel. If the Arabs laid down their arms there would be peace.”
Dear genocide-apologist Ely (Eli eli lama sabachtani),
Israel has been founded on a massive campaign of ethnic cleansing, long and carefully prepared in advance by David Ben Goerion (who can be best called the Adolf Hitler for the Palestinians) and his military and orientalist advisors. The fourth and final version of that plan was called plan Dalet. This campaign is documented well, like the so called new Israeli historians found out after they got access to declassified military documents, including orders to zionist militia not to make any distinction between guilty and not guilty while assaulting and destroying Palestinian villages to speed up pressure during the expulsion-project, although Israeli society still prefers to get drunk repeatedly on bedtimestories like that the Palestinians would have left their land voluntarily.
At the moment the ethnic cleansing started, only one third of the population in British Mandate Palestine was Jewish and only 5,8% of the land was in Jewish hands. Understandably, David Ben Goerion had accepted the unfair UN partition plan in which the zionists got, despite of the situation as mentioned, most of the land (56%) assigned. However in reality David Ben Goerion still wanted to realise his initial bid to the UN, namely 80% of Palestine. Needless to say that it is hard to establish a viable Jewish democratic state (a democracy in which the zionists will have and remain having the upper hand) even in 56%, let alone 80%, of Palestine, if only one third of the population is Jewish and merely 5,8% in Jewish hands. So the campaign of ethnic cleansing was meant to solve that problem.
So under the watchful eye of the British troops which stood by idly, a sheer terrorist-campaign against Palestinians was conducted by zionist militia like the Hagana, the Irgun and the Stern. Palestinian families were often not warned in advance but simply blown up or torched while being in their houses. People trying to leave their houses in fear were randomly sprayed with stengun-bullets. Pretty-looking Palestinian girls gang-raped. Palestinian men between 10 and 50 years old caught, separated from the rest, lined up and executed on the spot, based on dubious namelists of zionist intelligence officers, just to instill fear by the other remaining Palestinians or just for having fun. Many villages were totally destroyed and mines were planted in the rubble after, just to prevent Palestinians who managed to escape from returning. This happened especially after Palestinian resistance. Other villages were left behind by Palestinians in advance, who fled in desperation after they heard of the zionist violence. These villages were looted by zionist militia, after which houses, land and other possessions were assigned to Jewish families.
Furthermore, it’s another sick zionist fairytale that little Israel has been invaded by five Arab Goliaths, after the state of Israel was declared. In reality the zionist militia had the upper hand from the beginning for several reasons.
Firstly because the backbone of the Palestinian resistance against British favoritism of zionism during the British Mandate was already effectively broken by the British army during the thirties.
Secondly, because the zionist lobby was able to get Great Brittain in check, so it wouldn’t intervene.
Thirdly, because the zionists planned the campaign of ethnic cleansing well and long in advance, gathering intelligence in a systemic way about Palestinian villages and its inhabitants (the so called village files) while building up a capable force of well-trained militiamen - especially the Palmach, a section of the Haganah.
Fourthly, because the zionists succeeded in concluding a secret deal with king Abdallah from Transjordan, who had the only capable professional Arab army (trained and led by British officers) Israel had to fear. The agreement made was that king Abadallah could get the West Bank and East Jerusalem in exchange for looking the other way while zionist forces would take the rest by force.
Fifthly, because the zionists succeeded via the zionist communist party in Palestine to secure import from superior weaponry from the Soviet Union.
Sixthly, because there was in practice an enormous gap between the retoric used by Arabic nations in public on the one hand and the invading Arab militia on the other hand. The latter often mainly consisted out of poorly trained volunteers, which were inferior in numbers to the zionist forces, besides that they got not enough and often inferior weaponry, badly organised logistic supplylines and were often led by incapable commanders with different and competing interests.
Hence, let us not mince words here. At the heart of zionism (and the conflict itself) lies the idea of Jewish supremacy. Therefore zionism considers Palestinians just as subhumans or collateral damage, during the landgrab it envisions (which encompasses in reality much more than just the territory of former British Mandate Palestine by the way), as the history of zionism, not only during the period of the establishment of Israel as a Jewish state but also thereafter clearly points out.
At the same time the west is just supposed to swallow this utter criminality in silence because of feelings of holocaustguilt or in the belief of the so called enormous complexity of this conflict, like Desmet does gullibly, skillfully manipulated to do so by the powerful zionist lobby.
Description: When Israeli graduate student Teddy Katz meticulously documented a massacre of Palestinian civilians surrounding Israel's independence, he was initially celebrated for his groundbreaking work. But soon, he was stripped of his degrees and was publicly shamed as a fraudulent traitor. Decades later, incendiary new evidence emerges to corroborate Teddy's initial findings, not just vindicating him, but raising profound questions about how Israelis — and we all — deal with the darker chapters of history.
IMDb: In the war of 1948 hundreds of Palestinian villages were depopulated. Israelis call it 'The War of Independence. Palestinians call it 'Nakba"'. The film examines one village - Tantura and why "Nakba" is taboo in Israeli society.
https://archive.org/details/tantura_2022
Has anything changed? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECFpW5zoFXA Targeted ambulances, tortured and executed civilians. They tell me it’s “complicated."
Israel Shahak has a book you might want to read, here: https://archive.org/details/JewishHistoryJewishReligionTheWeightOf3000Years-I.Shahak/mode/2up
I found chapter 3 and 5 most interesting.
“I read your presentation, which I think is more a description of the details of the Israeli assaults and actions, than a well-argued disclosure.”
Well, maybe it's an idea to set the historical record straight first? Or are you really so naive to think that you can argue about this conflict without having any clue about that, just based on the general mood regarding the topic as perceived by yourself, supplemented with your apparent belief that history is determined by sheer contingency, plus some feelings in your underbelly?
Further, these “details” (in which you apparently fail to see any coherence or logic) show for most people, who study the matter concerned, and are not politically invested in the zionist project, a clear pattern about landgrab, apart from the fact that forced displacement qualifies as a war crime – just to mention another minor detail.
There is even resolution 194 of the General Assembly of the United Nations, which demands that Israel should let Palestinian refugees back in and compensate them fairly for loss of damage to their property, which, like may other resolutions of the General Assembly or the Security Council, Israel has never given any follow up to.
Anyhow, apart from the fact that we are just debating here in some minor comment-section on substack, it’s too easy to demand proof here like I am defending a dissertation or someone in court, while apparently you are not realising that your own assumption that the conflict can be reduced to a spiral of violence without any clear cause is equally subjected to that requirement and you are not entertaining the slightest effort to underpin this far too easy and risk-free belief.
Since you are not willing to engage seriously into this matter, I refer here only to Alan Pappé, The ethnic cleansing of Palestine, Oneworld Publications London 2006 for a good start.
With all respect Mia, but this is a comment section, not an independent Substack post or essay as the one written by Desmet where one would expect further links to back up sweeping (and above all uninformed!) statements.
Why be so critical at someone who is just posting a comment while you seem not to have any problem with Desmet’s empty words? (Yes, that’s my opinion too, and I recommend everyone here to read the works of authors like Ilan Pappe, if you want evidence so badly, pls go check it out!)
Desmet is writing about an ongoing genocide on an oppressed people as “where two parties fight, there are two to blame”, and he does advocate that it is better not to take a stance instead. This may be a very popular opinion among his readers but it has no factual basis and it does not show he knows history, not even a bit. There is an unequal power balance, a hierarchy, that makes it something very different than an endless spiral of violence with no beginning and no end. And yes, he may have to read some actual history books to be able to lecture his audience about this on a well informed basis.
And btw, the conversation in this comment section is not about the question of evidence as you like to maintain, with that you’re derailing the discussion.
It’s just very typical, and Desmet is no exception here, that many people from the anti-flu movement were crying about genocide when it came to vaccins and the Great Reset, but that they lost their ability to recognize an actual genocide when it’s happening now, in front of our eyes, live-streamed on social media. That is a huge double standard of which I think Desmet is guilty too with all his fuzzy talk about this genocide being “a classic human drama”, which is happening “because people lose themselves in petty sentiments.”
Injustice is not only bad when it is about to hit us personally. Many people from the anti-flu movement are not treating the perpetrators of the the genocide in Gaza the same way as they would judge Fauci, for example, and that is hypocrite.
Anti-flu? I am anti-covid-narrative and I can clearly see genocide happening. It's actually not that difficult, because the same people are behind all of these developments.
If you acknowledge the genocide, you must also be able to see the double standards within this so-called anti-covid movement?
do not delude yourself with fairy tales about the "right starting premise" when a systematic genocide against Palestinian civilians is currently taking place.
Are you saying that you are righteous and at the same time you support genocide?